| Author | Message | ||
     Tom Hagerty |
If people want to continue this psychological and philosophical discussion, here's a fresh page. The debate seems to divide people into two groups - two different ways of viewing reality. | ||
| michael |
hi everyone!! especially you Tom. There is no way on earth to stop balding process If you start balding at the age of 17, 18, 19.. That process, onec is started is completely irreversible by any exclusive positive thoughts. I can even say that at such early age most of positive thoughts concern sex, which actually increase the level of testosteron boosting the balding process.. Of course there is a potential possiblity that using some medication, vitamins, minerals plus positive thoughts may work synergisticaly. But there is no way on earth to stop MPB with positive thoughts exclusively. Positive thoughts would deffinetely not pass the FDA test, for its hair regrowth potential. From my 4 year experience with hair products I can say that besides medication, state of my mind play very important role in my hair regrowth and its condition. It was very importent during last year when my blood became toxicated by some bacteria, and I couldn't use propecia for a couple of months because the bacteria in my blood stream hated DHT blocker and forced me to quit treatment showing some terrible side effects. I got rid of this bacteria a couple months ago, and started treatment. Because I have very strong MPB gene, just after I stopped taking propecia I faced dramatic shedding. After a couple of months my hair reached very bed condition. Very easy noticeble bolding spot on the top of my head plus some temples recession. when I started back my Propecia treatment I knew that my attitude to the treatment will be very important to regrowth my hair. Thirst thing that I did was joining this forum, I just came up with this idea searching the internet for hairloss forum. I felt somehow that sharing my opinion about the products and experience will help me, and make me stronger. I really did not count for anything else. And as a matter of fact I was mistaken... I did not know that after a couple of years since I started propecia treatment, after my blood problem, I will be able to come to the better situation with my hair, even better from the time I started whole propecia treatment. Now I am 26 years old. Thge reason my hear look better each day, is complexed treatment which I can do because of some good spirits of this forum. It is especially you Tom with your SE, which I considered rediculous on this forum, first time I read about it. I am also greatfull for your nutrition advices which help me in everyday diet. I really make a huge progress with your advices. Thanks Tom again. I also would like to thank you all guys, which advices gave me the certain point of view. Within a couple of weeks I will present you the results of my treatment which looks really fantastic now, but I feel like I have the potential to get the full regrowth on my crown, so i will wait just a bit. Here is my nutrition info, which is a result of your advices: -propecia -nizoral (every three days) -nisim shampoo ( daily ) -SE - morning 10 min., evening 5 min., night 10 min. - green tee extract pills - brewery's yest pills - zinc pills - B6 pills - biotin pills - horsetail pills Food: a lot of brocolli. avoid coca-cola  ) PS: .. and a lot of positive thoughts of course!!! bye | ||
| Tom Hagerty |
Michael: I looked over your diet. A nutrient I think is important for good hair is missing. How are you getting your omega-3? I take some flaxseed oil and sometimes pop a evening primrose oil softgel. Walnuts are also a good source. This is just a question, not a suggestion, because I don't know how much B6 and biotin you're taking. Too much of individual members of the B-complex can effect the balance of the whole complex. Both B6 and biotin are important for healthy hair, but you don't want to overdo it - just as you don't want to overdo iron, zinc, or copper. Michael, what country are you from? I think you told me once, but I forgot. | ||
| Marc |
Tom: Is Biotin a member of the B-Complex vitmains? I think Biotin is actually vitmain K or H or something. | ||
| Jik |
if you "believe" that biotin is vitamin k, surely it will be! :P a last note to John i'll take you up on that offer - F@*& OFF!!! michael- how did you determine that your mpb gene was really strong? was it because you body was fighting the treatments? I think i'm right that tom began losing his hair around 19 and managed to stop it. | ||
| michael |
I am from Poland. John - I started loosing hair bye the age of 17. I find this form of MPB extremely disturbing psychologicaly and phisicaly, making life a terrible thing. It is really bed that only a little number of guys suffer this early kind of MPB, because from my point of view this is one of the worst desease of present times ( considering early age ). Poeple does not realize how it feels to realize that you are becoming a creature... while being so young. When I look into the future I'm not to optimistic.. concerning real cures for MPB. Steem cell therapy is a new form of doing transplants. So for the guys with hair remaining it will not work fine. There will be a need for some gaps between hair to make transplants work. That's why there always will be the risk of hair shock. On the other hand real gene therapy will not be ready soon, and as I can imagine it will be possible to do on the unborn child, whose genes will have to be switched. I can't imagine how it could be possible to switch genes of a mature person by any treatment. It sounds more like the fantasy to me. | ||
| Tom Hagerty |
Marc: It's easy to find out about biotin. Just read about it in any book on nutrition. I wish all problems on this discussion forum were as easy. | ||
| Jik |
gene therapy - i was talking to my doctor about mpb, and she was telling me that the mpb gene has been identified and treatment will probably be availible in the near future, but this may not be able to reverse any loss suffered. as for losing hair young, i started receding when i was 16. i saw these little hairs aound my hair line, and thought nothing of them, and remember just covering the my temples with my long hair. It wasn't until i was 20 that i really noticed it tho. 22 now, at the border between NW2 + NW3, i'm really sick of this hairloss thing! i do think that its reversible, as i've been doing tom's excercises and taking MSM for a month, I've noticed the tiniest of vellus hairs appear where my old hairline used to be - if those little puppies can make vellus hair, they can sure as hell make terminal hair. Even if you aren't optimistic about your hairloss being stopped, with technology like hair multiplication and hair cloning being researched, it's unlikely that you will be hairless for good. ;) | ||
| michael |
Your doctor is right. Gene therapy is now tested by anticancer inc. They composed a gene scalp treatment. This is only for external use. ( you will be able to message your scalp with a genetic liquid ). Gene responsible for hairloss was explored a couple years ago. Switching off that gene makes a potential for a hair regrowth up to 10 or even 15 years back. The problem is that if you switch this gene, there is a high risk of getting some kind of cancer ( over 50 % possiblity ). Now they try to find the way to reach the same effect, the other way around, by switching of a different gene, ( which they do not already know ) to reach comparible effect. ( I doubt it's possible - maybe it's better to find the way how to avoid cancer risk ) Because of that I assume that external treatment fights the same gene, which is discovered, but does not provide cancer risk by much lower potential of such treatment. The question is if external treatment can ever be as effective as internal one. For sure there will not be any pills available providing those ingredients which are in the liquid. ( to much risk ) At least this is what I personaly assume. This is all I know from the endless resources of internet. | ||
| Bobby |
JIK: In addition to Tom's exersise and MSM have you looked into any other treatments such as spiro, minoxidil, finasteride, tricomin or even dutasteride? | ||
| jik |
there are some great results possible from topical treatments. e.g rogaine; if you know what the guitarist from metallica looks like, you may be suprised to know that he's been using rogaine since it came out. pictures from the 80's show him with thinning hair, and now he's got a mane to be proud of! he was questioned about it in an english magazine interview, where he revealed that he'd been using rogaine, and that "it fu88ing works man!" there's also been sucess with "Oz Brew", a home made treatment which uses DMSO to penetrate the scalp and take minox and a couple of other ingredients with it. the creator of this treatment has had great success with it. | ||
| jik |
ar hey bobby i guess we musta posted that at the same time :P i'm considering using some kind of zix, just doing the research on it. i've tried minox and it wasn't good for me. i had a bad dream involving dut, and i'm not really into the idea anyway. there's another thread goin on about aloe, and when i looked up on it, it seemed that aloe is a kind of natural zix!. there's a lot of bases to consider in treating this, and i want to do it effectively by using things that have worked for others. i had a small amount of sucess with minox, with some little hairs gowing along the hairline, but i couldn't continue with the treatment. my eyes were getting blurry when i used it, and it seemed like the stuff was taking up a huge part of my day to day life. this is a good fight but i won't be selling my life for the sake of my hair! but anyway, i'm basically doing some research for a homemade treatment what are you usin bobby? | ||
| jik |
heh, i just realised that i'm also 22 and i'm tellin my story in this guys thread! 22 is such a sucky time to be trying to treat your freakin hairloss:$ 22 yr olds unite! we can bic each others heads! | ||
| Bobby |
JIK: That's unforunate that you had complications with minox. I've never heard of Zix, how is it supposed to help? Personally I use minox, proscar, folligen and nizoral and the scalp exercise. For a while I had some minor side-effects with proscar but now there starting to finally abate. You should consider using proscar or spiro. It's good to have something inhibiting DHT, to stop MPB at the source. DUT seems a little too harsh for me. | ||
| jik |
here's some zix links - creator's site: http://www.advinfoprod.com/hair_loss_treatment_1.htm spooky's site(this guy is a hairlosshero): http://www.angelfire.com/dc2/spooky/ i'm not into using dht inhibitors, as its open-ended messing with body chemistry. and too much for my liking. dht may not be the primary cause of hairloss, even finasteride is used to prevent 5-ar binding to testosterone to create dht maybe yu'd liek to check this thread out about a guy and his experience with b12 megadoses. its a good read and contains a theory that links homocystiene levels to mbp. http://www.hairlosshelp.com/forums/messageview.cfm?catid=10&threadid=31451 - sorry tom, i'm often linking folks to other sites. if this is pissing you off please tell me! | ||
| Tom Hagerty |
Jik: When you find something that you think will be helpful to people on the forum, post the link. I don't get pissed off. | ||
| jik |
let the linkage begin! cheers tom | ||
| jik |
get lost ken you are the officially awarded the "most dishonest man in hairloss" award for your constant attempts to flog a product that you refuse to tell anyone the ingredients of. unless they sign an non-disclosure agreement which means you own everything but their soul if they talk about your dodgy piils. if you think that this is unfair, why not just tell us whats in your treatment? you would get the utmost respect for dicovering a real mpb cure. what are you? a man with the cure, or a man with no honour? | ||
| michael |
Have you seen this site... I have just seen the section with hair pictures. Guys, this man is crazy!!! | ||
| jik |
ken, you have real problems. sort it out. | ||
| jik |
hey, i seem crazy now those posts have disappeared! at least im not trying to sell anything:P | ||
| Jenifer |
I'm not trying to sell anything either or rip anyone off in any other way, although some posters' reactions to my previous comments on the power of mind seemed to indicate they thought I was! Anyways...Tom said we could use this page to continue the discussion of that subject, and I think this quote on intention makes some very worthwhile points. As you read, think of how this could be applied to your goal of growing hair: The Genius of Intention "The force of intention is always available to us but we need to understand how to unlock its strength. It functions in the field of uncertainty where there are no guarantees. You have to detach from the outcome of your action, which means even though there is an objective to reach, and you have the resolve to arrive at that place, the truth is you are walking this path simply because you want to walk this path. The process is more important than the destination. There is a letting-go of expectation or attaining results even though the intention remains and the focus of energy stays on the present. You give up control, are willing to function in the field of uncertainty, and your concentration is on whatever you are doing in the moment. Indeed, this principle is really the key to living life, because you are brought totally into the present without worrying about the future or regretting the past. When you are clear about your intention and at peace with yourself, aligned and moving with purpose in your work, then magic happens. People appear, affinity projects emerge, support from unimaginable quarters suddenly manifests. What you need to accomplish your vision will become real, because of the natural attraction your clarity of purpose and focused energy creates. Your own zest for life and work will naturally lead you into the here and now where anything is possible and life is no longer defined by its usual limitations. You can feel the future unfolding as you relax into being in the moment, secure in the intention that what you are doing is the right action at the perfect time." The Genius of Intention Justine Willis Toms and Michael Toms -- co-founders of New Dimensions Radio. | ||
| jik |
w/e | ||
| Anonymous |
Tom what do you think about the link saying super doses of B-12 can regrow hair and is beneficial to stopping baldness? | ||
| Tom Hagerty |
Anonymous: I don't think super doses of anything are beneficial to stopping baldness. There is the mentality, though, probably in most people, that is drawn toward the super-dose remedy. For some people it's biotin, for others it's zinc, and for still others it's one amino acid or another. The list goes on. Of course B-12 is important in the diet as is biotin, zinc, and a multitude of other vitamins and minerals. The tabloids on the stands in the supermarkets always headline the one nutrient cure for weight loss or baldness because they know that most people want a simplistic answer for their health problems. Even the scalp exercise that I push is of little benefit to people who have horrible diets and ridiculous health habits. | ||
| jik |
have you checked the link for mr b12 above, tom? he claims to have been taking b12 for other health reasons, and found new hair growing on his head. there are a couple of pictures of his regrowth since he started on a topical of his own making. its worth a look, and i'll surely be keeping my eyes on this for the next few months. | ||
| Anonymous |
Jenifer, Maybe you should start a "metaphysics for hair loss" thread. That way if people want to learn and discuss more about how it can help them with their hair loss they can. By starting a new thread it will also help end the argumentative debates. People can go there to learn, discuss, and share their ideas and experiences and people that think it’s BS don’t have to go there. I would be more then happy to help in any way. It’s just an idea. Peace, John R. | ||
| Anonymous |
Oh and Jenifer I almost forgot, I think your quoted statements above are great. Especially the last one about being in the moment; fantastic quote. John R. | ||
| Jenifer |
Hi John R., interesting idea to start a metaphysics thread for hair, but I feel talked out on the subject right now. Glad you appreciated the above quote. I especially like what it says about walking this path because you want to, and that the process is more important than the destination. I actually think that every time we are using something that we feel will help our hair, we are using mind power and visualization. If we truly believe that something will have a positive effect, it often does. And yes, it's so important to stay in the moment-- makes for a much more fulfilling experience of life. | ||
| Jenifer |
John R., Why don't *you* start a thread about how you specifically apply metaphysics to growing hair? I for one would be interested... Jenifer | ||
| jik |
maybe you guys should just get married? :P | ||
| Jenifer |
Don't think so, jik...don't want to close off my options when I'm still so young! :-D | ||
| michael |
Johny Bravo wrote: ''Visualisation/metaphisics (and I have had experience with this) can certainly alter your reality experiences, but unfortunately cannot defeat genetics. It can heal diseases that are not genetic, and unfortunately MPB is not a disease it's simply part of genetic coding. Saying you can alter your genetic coding is like saying you can sprout wings and fly." I do agree that this MPB desease is stronger then any visualisation, but Johnny this is a desease unfortuntly. This is one of the worst desease of the present times. When you become a smelly conhead you cannot consider yourself a healthy person. Not even to mention your atractivness. It does not mean that if genes stands in the backround of your desease, it schould not be considered a desease. Gene therapies are under serious studies. The new generation of drugs are striking genes due to the steam cell research. However the hair gene therapy will propably be the last to consider for pharma industries... | ||
| Anonymous |
Jennifer would you date a bald guy if he had a nice personality and a great character? Plus a nice face and eyes? Just asking | ||
| scott runge |
hey anonymous ! just spit it out and ask her for her phone number . Just tell you're wife shes a rep. with the hair club for men foundation. S | ||
| Merowing |
Jenifer This I also believe in: I actually think that every time we are using something that we feel will help our hair, we are using mind power and visualization. If we truly believe that something will have a positive effect, it often does. Ancient science uphold the power of Visualization, and the power of the Mind. I use this as a part of treating hairloss(and everything else I do now a day) and believe it has helped. For me, what works best is to learn from the past, look to the future. But always live in the moment! | ||
| pete |
"I looked over your diet. A nutrient I think is important for good hair is missing. How are you getting your omega-3? I take some flaxseed oil and sometimes pop a evening primrose oil softgel. Walnuts are also a good source. " There are a couple of non-invasive tests that can highlight lipid problems - however your body should be giving you clues as to waht its short of. It is not necessary to take omega 3 if your body is not in short supply of it. I personally take an organic form of Evening primrose oil ( perhaps the best on the market ) I do belive its possible to hold back hairloss and encourage regrowth by : 1)Inhibit / blocking 5ar enzyme ( without causing an imbalance of hormones ) 2)Blocking "other DHT" pathways 3)Increasing prostaglandins to reduce inflammtion 4)Using a shampoo to reduce inflammtion 5)Using a topical re - balance the scalp immune response Pete | ||
| Tom Hagerty |
Of course you know, Pete, that your message raises a lot of questions. 1. What kind of evening primrose oil do you take ("perhaps the best on the market")? 2. How do you increase prostaglandins to reduce inflammation? 3. How do you block "other DHT" pathways? Don't leave us hanging, Pete. |
